See You On The Other Side

54 | Friendships and Healing: Navigating Complex Relationships When You're on a Healing Journey

July 10, 2023 Leah & Christine Season 2 Episode 54
See You On The Other Side
54 | Friendships and Healing: Navigating Complex Relationships When You're on a Healing Journey
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Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

How do you maneuver through the intricacies of friendships during your healing journey? It's a question that comes up a lot in this space, drawing from own personal experiences and conversations we've had. From recognizing when a friendship has outlived its course to setting boundaries and navigating complex dynamics, we've got you covered.

Friendships carry significant weight in our lives and hold the potential to influence our moods, personal growth, and overall well-being. The company you keep can wield incredible power, either propelling you forward on your healing journey or pulling you back into a negative spiral. We dive into the art of holding conversations with friends who may not be on the same path of healing, and those who are taking active steps towards positive change. We share our unique approaches, shedding light on the importance of communication, the transiency of happiness and pain, and maintaining boundaries.

Trust, communication, and balance of effort form the backbone of any friendship. We explore these elements in depth, discuss how clear and direct communication can save a relationship, and the importance of balanced giving and receiving. We also touch on navigating unbalanced friendships and the power of vulnerability. Then, we move onto the less pleasant aspects: toxic friendships, recognizing disrespectful behavior, and knowing when to step out. Let's unpack these complexities, and more, aiming to equip you with the tools needed to navigate the turbulent waters of friendships during healing. We're all in this together, and we're here to support you every step of the way.

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Speaker 1:

Hey, Shreemies, Welcome back to another episode of See You On The Other Side, Leah. what are we talking about today? Ooh juicy. It is juicy.

Speaker 2:

But not just friendships, but it's something that I think we have both struggled with. A lot of people in this space have struggled with. I don't know. Maybe it's talked about, but it's maybe not talked about enough. It's how to navigate friendships when you are healing and they're not.

Speaker 1:

We get a lot of DMs about this too. We do.

Speaker 2:

And also, I think it's important to know that if you're feeling this, you're not alone. When you Google something and there's article after article after article, do you not feel a little bit validated?

Speaker 1:

Oh 100%.

Speaker 2:

Oh my God, it's not just me.

Speaker 1:

The perfect example is when we started this podcast and people were like, oh, that's weird, you're going to really talk about that and you're a mom, and blah, blah, blah. And it's like article after article after article. So sometimes when I share some really good psychedelic news and share it to my story, i'm like, yeah, what's up haters? Yeah right, told y'all, told y'all. Harvard just posted this.

Speaker 2:

Sucka, i didn't say it, so yeah, there's like some validation that comes with that. But this is one of those things And I've talked about it in episode. I had to Google how to end a friendship when the person didn't do anything wrong. So that's what we're going to talk about How to know when it's time to end a friendship, and then maybe a little bit into how to do it, because I think that's the struggle is how to do it.

Speaker 1:

Oh, I'm struggle with that literally right now.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, literally, babe. I think it's going to like keep showing up. Sure, i know, not like this particular situation but, like.

Speaker 1:

And you and I respond very differently to this type of stuff. So maybe we can kind of elaborate on how different we are kind of in the dynamic of our friendships. Yeah, we're so different We are so different People think we're the same.

Speaker 2:

We're not.

Speaker 1:

We're not.

Speaker 2:

You are the feral cat, i am the golden retriever. I am so feral. It's weird, though, because, like we both are like a safe space for people, and we hear that a lot, but you are more intimidating and I'm more like the Hey guys.

Speaker 1:

I think you're more of a people pleaser in that way. Absolutely, and I think I definitely am have. I think I was just talking to you about this before we started recording. I definitely think that I handle a lot of situations like a man Males would like a more in your masculine Yes. Yeah, i have more of an androgynous energy And so a lot of times I'm dealing with situations the way that I do with other women. They're like wow, you're like really blunt and you're really like really say what you feel it.

Speaker 2:

You're really intimidating.

Speaker 1:

But am I intimidating, or are you intimidated, right, right, because oh, we should kind of I kind of want to get into like that good girl thing too, because that's like What we're conditioned to be. Yeah, so when you're not, other women are very. Other women struggle with it a lot because I'm opinionated and I do have really worked hard on the way I deliver things. But I am, i am very opinionated. I do speak my mind, i do. You know, if I do have an issue, i do share that. I have an issue, i do try to go to the source, but the intention of going to the source is trying to resolve it. Yeah, and I'm not really with the person. So there aren't, there isn't miscommunications when you go to all these other people.

Speaker 2:

Well, and sometimes I struggle with that too, because I was literally a few days ago struggling with, like I need to speak my mind and tell my truth and I'm going to say all these things. And then I get put in that situation and I'm like, but I don't want to hurt him And I go through that like, is it kind, is it true, is it necessary? If what I'm going to say is not beneficial to our relationship, then I try not to say it. If it's going to hurt someone, yeah. But if I'm trying to mend a friendship, i try to think of the best way to say it and put it in a way that they'll understand it Does that make sense?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, but I will. I'm not, i will not abandon myself to please you Right? I do like, i feel like your thing has been learning your voice and learning to use it up and when to use it, and mine has been learning how to use it, and sometimes I don't even need to use it.

Speaker 2:

Okay, i'm going to bring up an example, because this is another thing too, like your situation recently, where you didn't get to speak your mind because you it it involved too many people and you didn't want the other people to be affected by you speaking your truth. You know what I'm saying. This is where I struggle, because I feel some type of way about a person that's not directly Like in your, in my circle or. But if I say these things, it affects my husband's relationship with that person and I don't want to Damage that. Yeah so that's where I struggle, because I do wish I could speak my mind and say what I really feel. But if I say those things, it is going to Hurt a friendship then I think, you change your dynamic with that person.

Speaker 1:

Yes, because if you can't, which is where I am. Yeah, and I think that's okay, and I think that there are. There are still gonna be people where they kind of have to be in your life, or they just are. It just is what it is, yeah, and you just Maneuver differently around them. Yeah, you know, you get they, don't? they don't have to be like Your go-to for things or you know, if you don't want to go, you don't have to go right there, just has to maybe be some boundaries with it.

Speaker 2:

I was just gonna say there have to be some boundaries and you have to be able to Feel comfortable setting them. Yeah, Okay. So Let's start. What are some ways to know? How do you know when it's time to end a friendship Okay, or a relationship? friendship or relationship.

Speaker 1:

So the first thing that we have is somebody who is constantly negative and we all know that person who Kind of no matter what. They're always the victim. Everything's always bad. What was me? What was me? worst case scenarios. They don't realize like oh, i'm just using a name, becky, you're a grown fucking adult. Like if you don't like it, change it. These I can't. Like I can't even be friends with these people. They like I can't. I can't because I'm such a If I don't like something, i try to change it, fix myself, whatever. So when people just stay stuck in that victim mindset, i cannot even fuck with it. I feel like you are somebody who Gravitates towards them.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, i do, yeah, i did see, i like other feral people. Let me, let me, let me rewind that back, because I used to gravitate towards yes, yes, but that's Because you were that, i was that oh, that's some good accountability like I Say this a lot To my husband and I don't think he understands it your vibe attracts your tribe. And do you remember in an episode I said one time like when I Said something like you attract what you are, and it offended me because I'm like I'm not attracting narcissists. But then I realized I'm like, oh I, i was unhealed and I was attracting unhealed People and I was a victim. I was attracting other victims.

Speaker 1:

You were also a people pleaser and somebody who had no boundaries, so you know who loves people with no boundaries. Narcissists Yeah, that too, that's you, so it was a perfect match. It really was so in a the negativity this is where you know.

Speaker 2:

It's no secret that, like I struggled with depression and Would ruminate and I was Negative as much as I tried to be positive. But what I started to notice and we've talked about this before notice the way your body responds When you are in or around certain people or situations. Listen to your body. I Would get anxiety if someone would text me and want to hang out, and It wasn't because I didn't want to hang out with people, it was because I'm like, oh my god, okay, i'm gonna have to prepare to hang out with this person. I'm gonna feel very emotionally drained because everything is gonna be negative and when I am done I am gonna feel negative and I have to get myself out of that and Recover before I can people again. So the anxious part of that, the anxiety, was like my body's way of telling me like you probably Shouldn't be around this person your body's saying fuck, no bitch stay home right but This is the hard part, because I'm not saying that you should not be there for your friends when they are going through something debilitating or hard, or I Just think there's a difference When the person that you are talking to is like willing to make changes, and they're talking to you about their struggles, but they're like working on them Actively, yeah, and trying to get out of them, yeah does that make sense?

Speaker 1:

right, and when we like Happiness is temporary, happiness is fleeting, so is pain and grief and those types of things like I mean, you can carry grief with you for the rest of your life, but You have to actively do things to kind of get out of that black hole. And then there are people who just like to stay in that black hole.

Speaker 2:

Yes, and they're always a victim of every circumstance that they're in, right, so that Negativity whether it's like sad all the time, angry all the time, you know That affects your mood, to be around that constantly all the time, and In my career I didn't really have a choice but to be around it. Girl, same, like in the service industry, when you have like relationships with your clients and They are seeing you on a regular basis and it is like constantly just talking about things that they're going through but not doing anything about it. Like I did what I did for 12 years and Some of my clients, 12 years later, are still complaining about the things and The people and the situations that they were complaining about 12 years ago. And I have to hear about it And it's just difficult because I come home and I'm just in a bad mood.

Speaker 1:

Do you know?

Speaker 2:

why do you know what I used to do and do know why? now But yeah, what did you use to?

Speaker 1:

I used to contest it a little bit, i Never did that. Yeah, i used to be like, because I'm like, listen, if I have to fucking hear about this I train you two, three days a week, every week and I have to fucking keep hearing about you complaining, i'm gonna kind of put it back on you and gonna be like so what are you gonna do about it? Are you gonna, are you gonna leave? Are you gonna Go get some help, depending on what the situation was. But I'm like So what are you gonna do? because you're putting your life and everyone else's hands except for yourself.

Speaker 2:

So that's where you and I are different.

Speaker 1:

You know on that a little bit, or? yeah, i'll fire back at people.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, no, i mean that's not a bad thing. Like I wish I could do that, you can, and there were a couple of friendships That I had to end where I did have to do that and I did. They probably didn't take that well, didn't like what I had to say. Yeah, so The negativity part of it, like if you were surrounding yourself with people who are positive, who are uplifting, i also think like that statement is true. Like the five, you are a combination of the five people you surround yourself with. So look at the people closer to, closest to you in friendships and relationships and Do you complain about those people all the time? Do you look up to them? Do you go to them for advice? Do you appreciate what they have to say? If, if you are a combination of the five people closest to you, if your combination of what the are, then dissect what those people are to you, because you are going to be whatever they are. I.

Speaker 1:

Look up to you.

Speaker 2:

I look up to you too. Oh, i go to you for advice a lot, yeah, same I know. So that's like I appreciate what you have to offer, i appreciate what you have to say and You know My people right now okay.

Speaker 1:

I do too. Next one This is a big one for me, okay, lack of trust. I'm gonna tell you why. Okay, so I'm dealing with the situation. I'll just be transparent. When that When the George Floyd stuff happened It was I was, it was pre mushrooms I was so triggered by it and I know that that was my own Stuff that I had to deal with for sure. I was so triggered by that whole like racial injustice and things going on, and and I was triggered by it because of my experiences with racism, growing up in a Po-dunk town in Iowa with no diversity, and I had reached out to somebody who I Grew up with, who was there when I experienced a lot of those things and you know Saw how much I struggled with, not just my experiences with racism but experiences you know being poor, experiences with not having a father, experiences with abuse, like I Call them, like those are like og friends when they've been with you, like they know, like all the stuff, the childhood stuff, yeah, and so There's two people actually I brought up The racism stuff and they were eerily quiet. And I'm not saying you have to go make a social media post about it, but what I am saying is I've been vocal, that I've been struggling and you've been really, really quiet and you know, in something like that, i kind of have this expectation of you as my friend. I brought it up to one person and and immediately and it, i approached it and again, i Work on this a lot, i work on my delivery and being soft, but I also want to be honest, because that is who I am. Yeah, and I brought it up to somebody and They're like, oh yeah, well, you did this when I was going through this a year ago, but they never said anything to me, they never told me that What I did hurt their feelings. Right, and I'm very much at this phase in my life where I have enough of a hard time Dealing with my own emotions and my own trauma and whatever. It is not my job and not my responsibility to read your emotions. It's like I can't read your mind. You have to communicate with that me, communicate that with me, and if you communicate that with me, then I will. If I, if you came to me And you said this really hurt my feelings, i will own it. I will apologize. I will try to be better. I am a human who makes mistakes. I fuck up all the time, but if you, if I bring something to you and Then you weaponize something that you never even shared with me, that I had absolutely no idea that I did, that's gaslighting, yeah, and Not only did, and then and the other person I said something to, they're like what do you want me to do? You want me, you want me to make a Facebook post about it. I can't with my job and I'm like when did I ever say you should make a Facebook post about it? Yeah, whatever. Anyways, where I'm going with this is They talked to other people that I upset them, but they never addressed it with me yeah and to me, like now I don't trust you because if I have a problem with you I take it to you. I don't talk to everybody else about it, but you talk to everybody else about it, and I think that's where a lot of Communication can go bad, because people don't communicate.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I'm like it's not even like the communication goes bad, like there is no communication There is no communication and it's like you can't weaponize something that you never.

Speaker 1:

You never voiced it, you never voiced it. And so now I don't trust you. I don't trust you to come to me if, if, because I want you to come to me if right is bothering you right, and now I don't trust you, and now I think you just talk about me behind my back and anytime I, you know, bring something up that I'm struggling with you, weaponize, that I don't trust, you know, yeah, so I will, i guess, handle that accordingly.

Speaker 2:

See, i think I look at that trust From from what I have experienced. I had a friend in high school and college who slept with probably like three of my boyfriend Leah like.

Speaker 1:

I know, i know you making me so fucking mad right now, i know.

Speaker 2:

I know it makes me want to go back and be like what the fuck, leah, i Would you know, i just didn't want to let anybody go. I The abandonment issues were so fucking deep, yeah, that I was like, but she's my friend, oh my god, i swear to god, and it wasn't just me. She did it with like several people in our like little friend group. But that to me It's like if they do it once And then they do it twice, and then they do it three times. You know, we even that friendship eventually ended, thank God. But that was like one of those situations where it's like, well, it's obvious what it ended. You kind of fucked my boyfriend.

Speaker 1:

Oh, my God.

Speaker 2:

So that wasn't a friendship that I struggled with ending. When it did, I was. It was just like a yeah, no, we're done.

Speaker 1:

But what about something that's not as extreme as that where people, somebody may have lost your trust? Do you have experiences where it's not like like sleeping?

Speaker 2:

with your boyfriend. I think it's maybe what you're saying like trusting that like they would come to me if they had an issue, because I do feel like where I am in my life now, the people that I am very close to would tell me and I trust that they would tell me because it's happened And I would also go to them if there was an issue that was concerning Yeah, which is to me. I'm like, oh my God, is this like what adult friendships are Like? that's what healed friendships feel like This is crazy And I'm not afraid to come to that person because I know that they're going to hear what I have to say and not deflect or gaslight or you know yeah, yeah, and when you're unhealed, accountability feels like an attack always Yes, yes, so yeah, okay.

Speaker 1:

Next is unbalanced effort. I have some stuff to say about that too. I do too.

Speaker 2:

Okay, you go first, okay. So in this situation I think it's talking about like, if you are the one always putting in the effort to hang out, but the other person isn't making the effort back, if you're the one constantly like doing things for this person but they're not doing things back. I struggle a little bit with this one Because there were the way that you go directly to the source. For me, i kind of back off, make myself distant. I start to ghost a little bit, like I'm that person who, if I was ever on Tinder and I'm not like, but if I was ever single and I went on a date with someone and didn't like them after that, i would literally fucking ghost them. I would like delete my number, change my name, that's so different, though, because you don't owe them anything.

Speaker 1:

Cause.

Speaker 2:

I did that too. I'd be like I don't owe you shit, well and the reason I struggle with this is because whenever I started to notice the friendships that gave me anxiety, i stopped putting effort in, and so this is where I struggle, because when the friendship ended, they probably were like well, i did this and I did this and I did this, and I always reached out to you and you never reached back out. But that was my way of kind of like trying to end it, which didn't work. It didn't work.

Speaker 1:

And if you're dealing with unhealed people, they're going to be unaware. Yes, because they were unaware when you were friends, maybe the energy that they brought to the table. So if you're backing off, they're going to be unaware of that too. Yeah, so how did?

Speaker 2:

how has that worked out for you? I had to face it Good Every time, yeah. I couldn't run from it. It's almost like, no matter how much I tried to ghost like they would show up even more, Show up harder. Well, and also, you know, in their defense they can't read your mind, right, that was a lesson that I had to learn. Like they can't, so, and when it did come time to like it was, i swear to God, it was like the universe was testing me there. Like come on, come on, use your voice, you can do it. And then I did it and I was like, oh my God, i did it, like I said it, like it was really hard, but like I did it and it felt so much better. and that's when, like they couldn't read my mind. You're exactly right. But that was like a phase that I had to go through. That was a lesson I had to learn. I think in this situation it's it's kind of saying, like for me, like I'm there for you, oh, i'm going to take this another direction, because this is where I felt unbalanced. Like it's not about like you reaching out to me or us hanging out or how many times. Like you pay for my lunch and I pay for yours, like it's not that To me it was. You're always coming to me with your stuff and I hold space for you And I validate your feelings and I try to comfort you, and I don't get that in return When I come to you with my stuff. The few times that I do and I say that because I had a very hard time doing that you shut me down. Like I had a situation once where someone literally said, you know, she was struggling with being single and feeling alone And this was during quarantine in 2020 where I was like, well, you know, i'm going to open up to you about my relationship, I'm in a marriage and I've never felt more alone. And their response to that I'm trying to open up to you about where I am and what's going on and why I'm like depressed. And their response was, well, i would rather be married and unhappy than single and alone. And I was like, okay, okay, i obviously cannot come to you about my stuff and feel heard, so I'm going to stop.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

So that part was like very unbalanced.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, i relate to that too, in the sense that I am a naturally very curious person And I love to get to know people and I want people to feel safe with me because I didn't feel safe. So that's something that's very important to me. But oftentimes I get into these dynamics where you know, and who doesn't want to be around? somebody who's asking you a lot of questions and they want to know all about you, cause I mean, people like to talk about themselves And people like you know like to feel like they're special. So I've often gotten to a lot of situations where I do that because that's naturally who I am And I think they like that feeling. And then they don't, and I and I understand like some people just aren't as curious as I am. Like I have that awareness too about myself now, but they don't. They didn't ask me things or want to ever go deep about my stuff, and I probably kept that really close to me too. So I always felt like there was like this where I felt like they're therapists and I know everything and anything about their life, but they don't know shit about mine. So there was one time it was a client who was a friend and she was having some problems in her marriage And this was like with cheating and things like that. And this was like a three, four year thing where every day we talked about it and nobody knew, and I kept that secret and, and you know, she continued to stay with her husband, whatever. And one day I came in and I forgot what it was. Oh, i think it was like the day of Tony, my fiance. It was like the day of, like, his mom's death or something like that, and he was having a hard time. And so I came into the session and I was just like I'm just sad because, like I'm sad seeing Tony sad and he's going through this. She's literally texting on her phone, not paying any attention, and so what do I do? I immediately address it And I go. I go. I'm literally sitting and talking to you about something that's very personal, that like is like a struggle within our family, and I go and you're sitting here, not even acknowledging anything I'm saying and continuing to talk on your phone. I'm that bitch for sure, damn. And she was like, oh, i'm sorry And I go. No, but we talk all the time All about you And I go, and that's fine. But I was like like, i was like I'm like I don't appreciate that at all And it kept happening, yeah, and. But what's interesting is I'm like you know what? I set my boundary. You didn't respect it. I don't train you anymore, i don't really consider us friends, yeah, and I think that like hurt her feelings. But I'm like I said it And if, if, if you're not going to, you know, give me anything back in this friendship. That's fine, but we ain't going to be friends. Boo.

Speaker 2:

Sorry Yeah, very unbalanced, very unbalanced.

Speaker 1:

I feel like when I say this stuff, you're like Oh, i just wish I was more like that.

Speaker 2:

It's not because I think it's like Oh, my God, okay, shit, like I. That's. What I work towards is being more honest about things like that and calling it out and holding people accountable for that. Because there have been times where, like, i've opened up to a friend and they're like I didn't know any of this And I'm like well, because we always talk about you and your struggles, and anytime I have like tried a little bit, i get like I don't get any type of reciprocation in being interested in it, like, and so then I keep it to myself. But I don't want a relationship where I can't open up to you About what I'm struggling with and what I'm going through, without being told it's not that big of a deal and your problems are worse. That's such gaslighting It is, and there's like the imbalance there is like. the imbalance can also look like I'm the one who always calls you or texts you and you never call or text back, and just I don't know. I was watching a YouTube video this morning that was like you know, if that's the case, stop being the one that texts first and see how long it takes for that person to reach out to you.

Speaker 1:

And also be aware of the energy that you bring to the table. Yeah, like, if you are a chaotic energy, if you are a sad energy, if you can't take any accountability, like if you only talk about yourself, like, like, own, like, be aware of that, yeah, so, but I mean, we're talking about people who are unaware, so it is what it is, i know.

Speaker 2:

Right, right, right, right, right, right. We were unhealed.

Speaker 1:

Okay, growing apart.

Speaker 2:

This is the big one.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, Same. Another thing Can we normalize that? I mean, like as we get older, as we change, we evolve, we move away from each other. Like I also think it's okay to not necessarily be friends like what you were, maybe, like when you were together, and have that dynamic.

Speaker 2:

Well, think about what they say, but still be friendly. Yes, when they say, like, the person that you would marry when you're 20 is not the person you would marry when you're 30. Oh, fuck. no, it's not the person you would marry when you're 40, is not the person you would marry when you're 50, because you learn a lot of things through life experiences and you should be changing and evolving. And if I always say this and it sounds horrible, but if you were exactly the same person you were 10 years ago, why?

Speaker 1:

Which why There are, like people who like, let's say, they've been married for so long or together for so long, and people think that's a flex because of the quantity of time that they've been around each other.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Where I'm such a I can read people very well and somebody else's like goal is not necessarily mine, and so I'm like, yeah, they've been together, but they have not evolved together. They're complacent, they don't grow, they don't like talk, have any deep conversations. They don't fight because they don't talk about anything. That's hard Right. To me, that is not a flex of a marriage.

Speaker 2:

So if I'm going to turn this around on, like the marriage, if I'm going to use that analogy, like the 10, 20, 30 year marriage thing, the person that I am married to now is not the person I married, because he has evolved and changed, and so have I, and we're doing it together And it doesn't mean that we might grow apart one day because we end up growing in different directions. It doesn't mean that that's never going to happen, but why wouldn't that happen in friendships as well?

Speaker 1:

So we don't talk about that. We talk about relationships a lot, and it's Tony is not the same person that I started dating seven years ago. I am not the same person that he started dating seven years ago. We have and I think you know it's with friendships and with relationships. It's something you work at And you keep working at, individually and together, and you heal. And so he has chosen and I have chosen to do the work alone and together.

Speaker 2:

It has to be both, it has to be both. You cannot work together if you're not working individually. You really can't. So this is where I struggled, because once I started to notice these things about myself, once I was self aware and realized that I was always playing victim and that I didn't have to, or that I was the reason for A, b and C. It's like you can't know. You can't unlearn what you learn. There's no way for you to unknow what you know. And once I saw it in myself, i started to see it in all the people around me And it was very difficult because I was like learning to hold myself accountable, learning to change things in my life and wanting to help that other person do the same, but there was just no like. So I think I've maybe said this before like another way to know on this list, but another way to know that like a friendship is ending is when you want more for that person than they want for themselves.

Speaker 1:

Ooh, that is so good.

Speaker 2:

So that's kind of when, like, everything hit When I started to realize that I was changing and growing and I was trying to help them also, but I couldn't because they didn't want the help. And that's where I had to walk away. Yeah, and that's where, for me, it was the hardest, because there wasn't a conflict, there wasn't a disagreement, there wasn't a sleeping with my boyfriend situation, there wasn't an argument. It was just me realizing that I was growing and they were not. And that's hard, yeah.

Speaker 1:

Cause trying to have a conversation with somebody. They don't get it. They don't.

Speaker 2:

How many times have we interviewed someone and they have said once they are on their healing journey it is very hard for them to be around unhealed people And it sounds pretentious as fuck.

Speaker 1:

It does.

Speaker 2:

But it is not. Yeah, because we are trying to better ourselves, we are trying to align with people who are doing the same thing, we are trying to hold ourselves accountable, we are trying to be self aware, we are trying to have control over our lives in a way that we can, and I think it's important that you are with people doing the same things.

Speaker 1:

And here's something that I'll add to that To me, when I feel like a friendship isn't what it used to be is when I feel like they can't see me for who I am now. Like they can't accept that. So if I can't talk about the things that I'm passionate about, if I can't have a deep conversation with you because those are things that I crave and I love I love getting to know you on a deep level, i love sharing things about myself on a deep level If you can't do that back with me, i don't know what I'm going to talk to you about, because sometimes this friendship that I'm talking about is, if I bring something up, it feels like an attack. If I have a deep conversation, it makes them feel uncomfortable. If I bring up something about trauma, it's like well, you have that, i don't have that. Even though I'm medicated, i don't have that, i don't have those. And I'm like okay, i can't talk to them about anything, i can't show up as my authentic self because they don't accept it. They're thinking of high school Christine, who, you know, partied and did all these things. That's another thing too. When I go home, i don't want to go to the fucking bar. I don't Like home to Iowa.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, okay.

Speaker 1:

I usually don't want to go to any fucking bar, Like I don't want to drink. I don't want to talk about what we did in high school. I don't want to talk about a lot of past stuff I mean a little bit's fine but I feel like that's the only connection that we have, because you're not willing to see me for who I am now. So then that's the only thing we get to talk about You want to know that I don't get to talk about my kid. I don't get to talk about Tony. I tried talking about my kid, that went out the window, so I was just like so what can I talk to you about?

Speaker 2:

The good old days.

Speaker 1:

The good old days.

Speaker 2:

I read somewhere that that is how you know that your friendship group is stagnant, If every time you guys get together you are talking about the good old days.

Speaker 1:

But there are people who I did grow up with, who I can talk to them about this stuff Yeah Right. But there are who I can't. And it's not that I want the friendship to end, But to me I'm like what I'm saying is you don't see me and you're not willing to accept me for who I am now And what I need, and I'm vocalizing that I need this. So this dynamic has to change because it's not working for me And I can't like I can't.

Speaker 2:

I think it's like okay to be like reminiscent about the past, and I think this is another. This is maybe like a male female thing in friendships. Like I'm thinking about like, first off, male friendships are fucking weird. I think it's weird. They're so stupid. I think it's weird. Sorry, guys, i think that can be a whole fucking episode in itself.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, like they don't talk about, they don't talk about life Like it's like you like football, i like football too. Yeah Great, let's be friends.

Speaker 2:

Remember that one time in college, when this happened, i'm like how many times have I heard this story? Yes, we all remember it. I wasn't even there and I remember it. That's a whole another thing. But if you can't talk about what's happening in your life currently, then, like what are they? how are they adding value to your life, right? How are they helping you grow as a person And what's there that that is of substance, right? Like you know, it's hard, it's hard, it's really hard, it's hard. So I pay attention to that kind of stuff and it sucks when you start to see it.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I think you know, i think it's okay if that dynamic you don't like, you're not like, oh, fuck you bye. But if that dynamic shifts a little bit, this is not working.

Speaker 2:

And we can talk about that when we get to the part where it's like how do you do this, how do you end these friendships? How do you? Yeah, is this the last one? Yeah, number five.

Speaker 1:

Disrespectful or abusive behavior. Have you been in a situation where that it's gotten that bad?

Speaker 2:

I don't think I have, but I think it's because I am like the very passive one And so it. But I have been like manipulated, and because I didn't have boundaries and because I was a people pleaser, like I have been bullied into doing things I didn't want to do. And it's I want to say this because one person in particular was very, very, very pushy, very, very pushy and prided themselves on that, like was very good at their job, because they don't take no for an answer and it worked in their job. And then I started to realize it was also used on me. Oh shit, like the hey, let's go out this weekend. I can't. It's my husband's birthday weekend And I have to stay home with the kids because he's going to a concert. Well, what if we get a babysitter? Oh, like relentless Well no, because if I get a sitter, i'm going to hang out with my husband Because this is his birthday. This is his birthday, and then another. Well, what if we do this? And then it's like, and then I just stopped responding because I'm like, oh my God, i've said no like three times and they're not hearing it. And then, like four days later, did you think anymore about going out this weekend? And I'm like I literally already said no. And then the day of, are you sure, like it's that, like the pushy, like I used to fall for that after the second try. And then when I started, like really holding my boundary, and no is a no is a no, so abusive. As far as like getting into, like fights, i don't think I ever really got into a fight with a friend because I was just the like the passive one who would just take it. But I have been manipulated And I have been gaslit And I have been, maybe emotionally, oh I'm sure, but I do want to. I like think about Vanderpump rules with this one, about how fucking toxic it is and how they get into fights every season, and it's the same kind of fight with the same kind of person And I just don't want to be in a relationship where that's just how we are, like oh, we just fight, like sisters, that just we're always fighting. That's just how sisters fight, like that's how families are, and I'm like I don't want to be in that kind of relationship.

Speaker 1:

I was in that relationship at home with my freaking sister. So, like that's the most, like I can't that. That's another reason to why I like to just go directly, talk about it, figure it out, come up with a resolution, be direct and honest And or, if they're not open to it, be like okay, well, this is what I need And I'm not getting it, so maybe we need to readjust Right.

Speaker 2:

So have you ever been Like an abusive type of like friendship?

Speaker 1:

I wouldn't say abusive, because I think I'm definitely hold my own way too much for something like that in a friendship. But there was a situation where, after I got divorced, I started hanging out with this girl huge partier, huge partier And when, after you get divorced, it's like it's cool for a minute, but then it's old And she was a big drinker, Was always in and out of different relationships And there was always so much drama. It was just very much so an energy sucker and very much so the pusher, like come on, go out, go out. And when people aren't mean and aggressive, I actually struggle with it Because I'm like, oh, fuck, you know. But she'd be like come on, go out, go out. And so I would, I would, I would, And I'm like I don't want to And I keep saying no and you're not really respecting it, So it's so. I would just be like no, and I would be like I'm busy, I'm whatever. And then we just kind of slowly stopped being friends because she never respected my boundaries. Well, that made her mad. Yeah, So she goes on Facebook and she would like. There was one time she posted a picture of like a throwback Thursday and I'm in the picture and she literally scratched my face out. What I've never told you, this I didn't tell anybody this.

Speaker 2:

This is an adult.

Speaker 1:

So and I'm going to make this clear I am like feral as fuck, but if you're not worth my time, I'm not going to engage back with you. Yeah, I really am not. Yeah. So somebody reached out and they're like did you see that she did this? Like that's so mean. And so she crossed my face out. And then another girl like wrote like something mean about me, about how, like, I didn't hang out with them anymore, like whatever, She's like too good for us. And I'm like no, you guys just never respected my boundaries. But okay, there's more to this. And like, holy shit, literally in the comments, talking crap about me. I was like, okay, but I'm like they don't really matter because they're fucking messes. So like, if I'm not going to let somebody who I don't even want to hang out with ruin my day, So then let's fast forward. So that was like 2015. Okay, Okay, Fast forward to a couple of months ago. Never said anything. She messages me on Instagram, Probably. So she like deleted me on Facebook but then kept following me on Instagram and I was just like whatever, keep seeing my shit and whatever. So she messages me on and she's somebody who very much so is like peace, love, light whatever. And I'm like now that, No, maybe to some people, but on a deep level, like you handle things super fucking toxically. Anyways, she messaged me. She's like Hey, girl, what's up? I've been seeing what you've been doing with the podcast and with mushrooms. I think that's awesome. Blah, blah, blah. Like I love that you're on this journey. I've been using mushrooms too, And then it was like you know, I really just wanted to let you know that I like want the best for you. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Hope we can reconnect. So I responded back and I was like Hey, thank you so much. She's got three kids. One of them, like, is special needs and I like love that little girl. So I hated ending that friendship because then I lost a relationship with her kids. But anyways, I digress. So I was like thank you so much. Like you know, I still follow your daughter and how she's doing health wise And I love that. You know she's doing well. Your kids hope you're happy. Blah, blah, blah. But let's not forget, I know about this, that and the other, And that was straight up bullying And I don't agree with it And I thought that was really crass and really mean and you never once apologized or took accountability. So wish you well, but no thanks.

Speaker 2:

Nothing after that.

Speaker 1:

No, she didn't respond And I don't really care, But I'm like you're gonna, if you're gonna, come back into my life. You owe me a fucking apology.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I was literally you're going with this and I'm like Oh, did she reach out and apologize? Oh did she reach out and own that? Okay, okay, okay. Now, if she would, have.

Speaker 1:

I would have been like thank you. I appreciate that you said that I'm sorry if what I did hurt you. I felt like my boundaries weren't getting respected, but I just said that in the message. I was like you never respected my boundaries. I was going through a divorce. I was going through something very traumatic. You never respected my feelings So I slowly backed away from the friendship and how you responded was bullying me on the fucking internet like a loser. Sorry, but no, i didn't say it.

Speaker 2:

I know what you mean.

Speaker 1:

I think when I replay stories back, i'm like yeah, i said this and I said that I said it nicer than that, but I was very direct and like no, that's a form of bullying.

Speaker 2:

The way that we are different. Because you're saying all this and I was a people pleaser to the point where I wanted everybody to like me. I couldn't handle if someone had anything negative to say about me, to the point that I would be like what did I do? Why are you saying these things Like so? if I would have seen the bullying, i would never would have like addressed it. I just would have like crawled in my hole and died because someone thought something negative about me and I didn't know what they thought and why they thought it and I couldn't explain it and I would just be like I don't know what I did.

Speaker 1:

That is something that even pre-mushrooms I've been very good at, because that was pre-mushrooms and I was like, oh gosh, you guys are really going to take to Facebook fucking losers because that is I'm sorry, that is loser behavior. We like we are better than that to do that. It's not okay. There was no way you're going to come back and come talk to me without owning that you. That was super immature.

Speaker 2:

I guess that's it's like. I know that people can evolve and change Sure, and if that's what's going on with this person, then you know there can be like, a mutual like. I wish you well on your journey. Still, wish her well. Yes, i was in like, but I can't. No, i don't like reconnect. I can't reconnect unless this is like. It would take a lot for that.

Speaker 1:

So you were talking about Vanderpump rules? Yeah, you are Ariana.

Speaker 2:

Oh.

Speaker 1:

I am Lala.

Speaker 2:

Oh, my God you are. I used to think you were saucy.

Speaker 1:

No, i am. if I really love you, i'm so fucking ride or die for you And also I will advocate for myself. I will advocate for the people I love. I will fight for myself and fight for people fiercely. You are Ariana because you are kind of Switzerland. You're not so much anymore.

Speaker 2:

I was going to say there are parts of her, though, that I've watched, where she was a mean girl, and that was never me. Well, they're all mean girls, Yeah, so you know what I mean, and I used to think that I was like for anybody who doesn't have Vanderpump rules. I'm only like on season seven and you've like finished it, but like, so there are parts of it that I don't know about, but I used to think I was. Sheena Finished it. You're a diehard, i'm diehard. I used to think I was Sheena. You are in the sense that you're a huge people pleaser. Yes, and she just wants everybody to like her Oh my God, and that's me, used to be me. I relate to Sheena, and then I saw how much of a bully she also was and I was like, oh, i don't think that's it.

Speaker 1:

So they're all toxic, they're all like a toxic, and also she is such a guy's girl where you are truly a girl's girl.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, i also see like growth in some of them where I can relate to one of them in one way and relate to another one in another way, which is wild. So, yeah, i do feel like I was like a little bit Ariana, like I'm just like I don't want to, i'm just involved myself in this drama And it's why I kept my friend group separate, because I didn't want there to be like drama in the group.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, but I want to add to that. Okay, so, and again, i know these are toxic people. Okay, lala is very opinionated, very aggressive, very intense, very witty, sarcastic. She's fucking ruthless. Ariana is more toned down, sweeter, whatever. Now there is this cheating scandal. If you have been living under a rock where Ariana gets cheated on by her boyfriend of a decade and the entire world, like this was covered on fucking CNN, oh, i didn't know that. Yes, damn, like Adele just talked about it at like one of her concerts. Like this is like, even if you don't watch the show, you kind of have an idea of what's going on.

Speaker 2:

Jennifer Lawrence knows who these people are.

Speaker 1:

Okay, but Jennifer Lawrence is a diehard Yeah, so but anyway she get. Ariana gets cheated on by her, her life partner of like 10 years and whatever, and the world feels so bad for her, as they should. He's a piece of shit. But the difference is it's easy to feel bad for her because Ariana is a good girl, ariana is a nice girl, ariana is like this and that and whatever.

Speaker 2:

She's not bully and she's not Yeah, okay.

Speaker 1:

Whereas and again, not saying that what Lala did was right. But Lala got with some guy and she was like again 21 or 22 when she met this man and was newly to Hollywood. He's this producer who's much older, much richer, so, we think, much more successful. There is a power dynamic there and people don't, and then he ends up being pretty much like a mini Harvey Weinstein. I mean, he is a. He has like he had like a casting couch, like a lot of there's like he has like a lot of lawsuits against him. His house is going in foreclosure, pretty much like sexual assault, racism within the workplace. He's a piece of shit too. But people don't feel bad for her because she's opinionated, she's a strong woman, she's intense, she's aggressive, she's all these things And it's, i guess, where I'm going with this. It's, it's, i feel, like a lot of women. When it's an assertive man, it's how it is, but when it's assertive, an assertive woman, it's she's a bitch, she's intimidating, she's this, she's that. And I very much so relate to Lala in that sense because I genuinely feel like I do try to deal with things in a healthy, direct, honest way And I get met back with a lot of pushback because I don't like. I'm the bad guy because I came and told you that you hurt my feelings, but you're not the bad guy because you talked about me behind my back to everybody else.

Speaker 2:

I feel that you're not the good girl.

Speaker 1:

No.

Speaker 2:

I'm the good girl.

Speaker 1:

Right. So sometimes I feel like with my trauma and things that have happened to me, people don't feel bad for me because, oh, and I'm my parents do this too.

Speaker 2:

It's like they see you and they're like she's got it, she didn't need help. But they feel sorry for the people like me because I was like quiet and didn't speak out and but you don't. If the same situation happened to you, people would feel less sorry for you 100% because they were probably like well, she was kind of like feisty and she was a little bit of a bitch And the probably why he did those things. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1:

You hear what I'm saying, holy fuck, mm, hmm, and I have felt with a lot of female friendships that like I'm too much and to this and to that and too loud, but yet if they've gone through something really hard, guess who goes to bat for them.

Speaker 2:

You do.

Speaker 1:

This one unapologetically, no hesitation, which is lala. But I often feel like there's this huge imbalance and, like I always have said, everything is deeper than what it is. Yeah, you may see this strong, confident, because I do think I am confident, but I think I also like it's a really good front and it has been a really good front because it had to be a really good front And he sees that like soft little girl who needs nurture and love and validation and affirmations and he sees a softer me where sometimes with friendships I wish that they put enough effort to like really maybe understand that there is more to me if we just could get through and have those deep conversations or those moments or whatever. But it's like, especially with my childhood friends, i'm like, i feel like they don't factor the abuse multiple times or rape or racism or any of that. They don't think about that because I am who I am.

Speaker 2:

So what I am seeing is like Ariana is inside of you, Lala is just the exterior And you're like I also deserve compassion and empathy and this and that and this And the same things happen to this person. That happened to this person, but you're putting this one on a pedestal because she didn't deserve that And you're saying this one deserved it because she was this way. I hear exactly what you're saying Yeah, When it's like nope, the same thing happened to both women.

Speaker 1:

Right. And then two like I have a deep mother wound because I was the lost, ignored child, because it was like she'll figure it out She always does, she always does.

Speaker 2:

She doesn't need my help.

Speaker 1:

So that's why it's like with friendship it's so important to me, but I don't think that they understand how important it is to me, even when I stress that Yeah.

Speaker 2:

I love that comparison, so Okay. So how do we deal with situations like this? How do you break up with a friend when there was nothing they did wrong?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, where it's just kind of who they are.

Speaker 2:

Do you want me to say what I've done? Yes, because to the people who aren't like, straight to the source, this is why this is what you did and this is why I don't appreciate it. Like for the people who are more like me where it's like, but I don't want to hurt their feelings or I don't know how to end it, i'd prefer to ghost The times. And sometimes I struggle because I'm like what if these people listen to this episode? This hasn't happened once, or even twice. It's happened, like, multiple times where I've had to do this. So I'm not calling one person out specifically, same. I finally had to figure out a way to put into words why I wasn't showing up for them, and it was very hard to say because I had to be like it's not you, it's me, i'm not going to take it personal. And then I also would say you know, but my fear and my struggle with coming to you with this is that I know you always take things personal And I don't know if you're going to hear what I have to say in the way that I'm trying to say it, but I'm going to say it anyway. I am in a place in my life where I am more in touch with who I am and who I have the capacity to be around, and I am trying to pull myself out of these holes and I am trying to change things in my life. And I can't be around someone who is negative all the time because it keeps me in that negative spiral And I am not asking you to do anything about that. That is a me thing. I am aware of the type of person that I am now and realizing that the more I surround myself with negative people, the more I stay in my depression. I have to pull myself out for me And I wish you the best And this. I didn't say this, but but I it's almost like I don't hate anybody. I'm not mad at you, i'm not upset. You know, everybody is on their own journey. Like, i love you as a person, i love you as a friend and I wish you well And maybe one day we can come to a place where we're together again. But right now I have to remove myself from this friendship because I'm doing something different.

Speaker 1:

You should be so proud of how much you've learned to use your voice, because when you do use it, you still use it in a way that's incredibly soft and direct, and I wish to be more like that. I'm working on it, but it is it's. It is to the point and it's direct and it's honest, but it's still kind And I think it's still like you're advocating for yourself but not being like mean to anybody.

Speaker 2:

You're, you know, and I think that's you want to know what I think is like super relatable about that is like doing that boundaries are fucking hard.

Speaker 1:

Doing that.

Speaker 2:

I was like, oh, like I had so much anxiety, like it took me days to write the text, sometimes weeks to write the text. I was, i was around and yeah like sometimes it takes me a very long time to write it, and in my notes app, like there'll be like seven different drafts and then I have to condense it. and then I'm like, okay, no, if I say that, they're going to think that's being mean, i'm going to like, take that part out. but I'm saying that because, like it doesn't mean it was easy. but as soon as I sent the text I was like, oh my God, i feel so much better, like it's like a huge weight lifted off my shoulder. But then the part of me that struggles with being that way and being assertive and being direct, like that still struggles. So then it's like and now I'm changing my phone number, but I think it's I don't, but I think it's.

Speaker 1:

I think it's, i think it's, i think it's good that you did something hard, and you did it anyways, and I had to do it multiple times and I will say it got easier every time, i'm sure, i'm sure.

Speaker 2:

Every time I got a little bit easier.

Speaker 1:

What about people who you?

Speaker 2:

have to be around.

Speaker 1:

Or you just want the friendship to change and it be okay. Oh, okay, Like you, you don't necessarily want to be like I can't be friends with you anymore, but it's like you know, if I'm around we can hang out. I know it's going to be probably super, super official and it's not going to be things that I necessarily want to talk about, but it's, it's okay, Like, cause I don't. I think, you know, not every friendship is somebody you have to, like, go deep with.

Speaker 2:

Hundred percent.

Speaker 1:

But if you're like trying to be a part of like my core and we're having like phone conversations, i don't want to talk about bullshit, like I don't want to waste my day talking about bullshit. I don't want to talk about.

Speaker 2:

So I also think that there are levels to friendships and I think the hard part is when they were like one of your core friends. I think it's okay for people to have a different place in your friendships, but sometimes those core friends will get very angry that the dynamic has changed. Does that make sense? Yeah, And I just want to be okay.

Speaker 1:

I like, i want all people just to be like no, we can still be friends Yeah. We're so different though, like we don't really have much to talk about anymore and that's okay, like we are on very different paths, we still have so much love for each other.

Speaker 2:

I think it's like you know, sometimes in adult friendships you see each other once or twice a year and I love that we get together once or twice a year And I'm okay with that, right. So I value the friendship that we have. But then there are others where it's like you have to if you're not showing up weekly or daily or bi-weekly. That's where it's like no, this is exhausting and it's draining And why can't we be those friends that get together once or twice a year? I have lots of different types of friends who I can like go to coffee with and we talk for hours and it's meaningful and I love them, but I don't see them on a regular basis or even talk to them on a regular basis.

Speaker 1:

Those are some of my favorite friendships I have, so many, so many of those.

Speaker 2:

So do I, and I love them. I am too. There are no expectations, there's not pressure, there's no pressure to hang out, and we respect each other's boundaries and we have meaningful conversations, and I can count on that person to be there for me if there's something that I need them to be there for me with.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, And I love like the people that we've met in this space. So just it's like going to coffee with somebody, going to some type of healing event and having like a really good bonding experience, whether it be like you're having an experience or you're just having a conversation And like then you can go your separate ways. You know, still contact each other on social media, wish each other well, go to each other's events, go hang out, whatever, But there's like we barely hang out together. Yeah, I don't think people understand that. People don't understand that, like, because when we get together, it's we're working and I am very, i'm very, sacred with my time and I didn't have a family and now I do, and so, like, i love being at home with my family in your free time, and so when, when I have friends who kind of push me, like what are we going to hang up? What are we going to hang up? Never And it's not personal, it's because I like being at home. Yeah, like that's all.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so no, i think that too, for the people who, like you, have to be around because it's like a friend of a friend, or like I just think, like it's important to remember not to take things personal.

Speaker 1:

That too.

Speaker 2:

And just have some invisible boundaries within yourself, Know that like you can only be around that person so much and respect that about yourself, Like it doesn't mean anything's wrong with you, but just limit your time around them as best as you can. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

And you can. you can approach it the Leah way or the Christine way. Leah's trying to approach it my way and I'm trying to approach it like Leah's way, right, and.

Speaker 2:

I think that's a balance there. I agree, yeah, and we learn from each other in that way. So much I've gotten. You can say the same thing two different ways, and one be heard one way and one be heard the other, and it just depends on the audience.

Speaker 1:

Can I? can I also, too? I feel like I make misconceptions about myself. Anything I've ever talked to you about, yeah, i've been very honest, but also very conscious of like I don't want to hurt your feelings. I don't want it to be a fight. I do not try to come at it combatively, like I've genuinely worked on that You really have.

Speaker 2:

Okay, It's like you've said it before like you used to run hot. Now you're a light simmer And I'm like the ice cube and you're hot coffee, Like you know what I mean. Like I'm like, but I'm too like this way, You're too this way And it's like I am trying to be more this and you're trying to be more that.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, that's so true Okay.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, okay, i'm wrong with that. All right, i don't know where to go. For me, like I'm like, friendships is a really difficult, complex subject And it's really not talked about.

Speaker 1:

Maybe we could have an expert come on and talk about like navigating friendships, yeah.

Speaker 2:

I don't think that there's anything wrong with you for feeling this way. Your feelings are valid. You're not alone. This is something that we all struggle with. It's just taking action is the hard part, and knowing where to put people in your life When you're on your healing journey, yeah, so that is all. Be kind to yourself, be gentle with where you are and what you're seeing, and have grace, and there's nothing wrong with you. You don't have to hate the person.

Speaker 1:

No, no And.

Speaker 2:

I don't have even energy for hate, Like yeah.

Speaker 1:

Even if, even if we're not friends, I still wish people well. even if I feel like they did me dirty, Still wish them well.

Speaker 2:

The girl who, like, slept with my boyfriends. I still am like I don't hate you. I was really sucked up But, like I also understand, you got a lot of trauma. I just don't want to be a direct hit for that unhealed version of you.

Speaker 1:

Good awareness on you though to like, realize that it's so much deeper than just being about you and she is always deeper. Right That you see that like that was a really hurt person doing some really terrible things because she was hurting.

Speaker 2:

So Right, i just don't want to be in. Yeah, i just don't want to be a direct hit. Exactly, exactly. I'm just removing myself from the crossfire. That's all.

Speaker 1:

And if you guys have any suggestions on you know topics you want just Leah and I to cover, about just kind of random shit that you know maybe you have to face on this healing journey, shoot us a message. Or can I say this I'd love to talk to you.

Speaker 2:

If you follow an account or a page or some therapist or psychologist who has talked about this specific thing. I would love to have someone come on and talk about it from an expert lens.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, i mean like that's like nothing, not things that you go to therapy for, but like friendships. they're like they're with you through childhood, through divorces, through breakups, through parenthood, like they're with you for a lot of those things.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

So, Bye.

Navigating Friendships During Healing
Surrounding Yourself With Positive People
Trust, Communication, and Unbalanced Effort
Growing Apart in Friendships
Navigating Toxic Friendships and Setting Boundaries
Friendship, Boundaries, and Apologies
Navigating Complex Friendships
Self-Preservation